As Bill P. pointed out history has told us this self governance stuff is tough. It always has been tough and always will be tough. There is no way around it. It is what it is. Trying to meet the demands of competing minority factions with limited resources is not easy. Before I joined the board I often heard Board members say I owe a fiduciary duty to the corporation. Having been through many a wall street takeover battles I have heard similar battle cries from people who actually understand what that phrase means. Quite simply, as one who worked for target corporations it meant we were duty bound to maximize shareholder value. Our CYA was a fairness opinion from a Wall Street investment bank. I grew sick to my stomach hearing many prior and a few current board members hide behind that phrase knowing that they did not know what it meant. I will offer my view for what it is worth. I have come to the belief that the RCSC's boards' duty to the corporation is almost always a duty to the majority of members of the corporation. The member's rights are essentially limited to electing at least 1/3 of their board representatives every year. The right to vote. In the case of Sunbirds the rights of members are further restricted because they are not eligible to serve on the board which is the sole decision making authority of Sun City. (ask Bill P. about the history of that.) RCSC's CYA is they can spend an unlimited amount of your money on legal fees defeating any individual challenge. So, if you believe you are part of the future of Sun City, be engaged and informed. Get very involved in the rest of your life. Sorry for the preachiness, Thank you and God Bless, John
Thank you John, but no. I am currently working on some research projects of this town, but there is no way in hell I will be a part of anything Bill, Dave, Jean and several other people are doing. I am pretty much up to speed on TOSC and I understand now that what it is now was not the intent at all. As always when Bill is involved he makes it all about him, and others just get sick of it and leave. There probably have not been more than 10 members at a time posting here. Every 4 years, go ahead, look back and you will see Bill tell anyone who is a conservative to take their shit sandwich and go somewhere else. Tom McClain comes to mind. I see people every day on Nextdoor talking about how badly they were treated by the foundation. 3 just today. Sun City does not care. Folks were giving these 3 people advice on who to contact. Bill has been involved long enough. Time to back off and let others have a try without his input. But he can't do that. He has quit this site about 5 times now and no clue about chit chat. Sun City would crumble without his input. Bill has been a major player here for over 20 years. Let me ask you all, are we better off today than we were 20 years ago?
John's opening remarks weren't "preachy," they were the reality of living in a community that made a decision 60 years ago not to become a city. In fact, the exact date the only time an actual vote was taken, was the beginning of Dec in 1964. It was voted down by a 2/1 margin. In 1971 the Home Owners Association (HOA) of Sun City (they didn't become SCHOA until the mid 2000's) took a straw poll vote of their members and 95% of those voting said they wanted us to stay the same. From that day forward, organizations were either forged or grew out of necessity. In the HOA's case, their founding documents were drafted with the assumption we would incorporate. Had that happened their role would have simply been interacting with state government and their agencies. It wasn't until later when they began crafting enforceable CC&R (1978 was the first court case) and then in the early/mid 80's where age restriction language was added. That was prompted by Federal and State legislation allowing for senior communities to be restrictive in who lived there (Fair Housing Standards Act). While it is ancient history to some, it foretells DEVCO and the community leaders ability to evolve and grow. We know during the past 60 years that has happened each step of the way. In later years, sometimes driven by the board, sometimes driven by the general manager. I would argue it should be have always included the membership, but for a period of time, we pushed them away. If we ever are to regain our true sense of community, it will take a much more pointed effort to let members be equal partners in the decision making process. What that means and how it is shaped is still a work in progress. Not my job to tell anyone how it should work. My role is simply telling folks what has worked in the past...and what hasn't. John's right...members need be involved.
After attending the board meeting, I was very encouraged by the civility on display. I know the GM has stated incivility is on the rise in Sun City, but we also should recognize we are in the middle of a very contentious election cycle. I also vividly remember sitting in a board meeting way back when where MCSO had posted armed officers AT THE REQUEST OF THE BOARD AND MANAGEMENT with about nine clips of ammo on their bullet proof vests. Today's meeting was much more civil. At the risk of oversimplifying, I think the crux of today's meeting was normal housekeeping kind of stuff, including approving a budget which had been shared with the entire membership on time! There were a few rules changes that were passed and some that were postponed for further consideration by the board. I scanned some of the rule changes and they all seemed pretty reasonable to me. I am confident they will be changed again in the future. It is just the nature of things. After the formal meeting there was a planning session to provide information about the architect's final recommendation for the location of a possible theater. They selected the west side of Lakeview, and I thought they provided ample rational for their selection. As an individual member I am concerned about the cost benefit of such a building, but I am hopeful the LRPC will kick those tires again. I noted that there already seems to be some budget creep as the architect mentioned a 10,000-12,000 square foot building whereas the elements list prepared by the board capped the size of the building at 10,000 square feet. I am encouraged by the increased transparency and civility these meetings now contain. The standing committees are once again involved in the decision-making process. My hope for the future is for more member engagement and the development of a comprehensive master redevelopment plan. RCSC's future is looking brighter, and I no longer have to worry about the need for armed guards at the door. (AND BE SURE TO CHECK OUT THOSE NEW LAKEVIEW FOUNTAINS AT NIGHT - THEY ARE BEAUTIFUL!) Thank you and God Bless.
I doubt if the lawn bowlers are going to be excited about the architects' recommendations. Did the presentation indicate where they recommend the lawn bowling courts would be moved to?
Justification for this monster? Don't we have 2 now? Any studies re how many use the current PAC's? How many shows per year? $14 mil when the ASU survey showed all we wanted were walking paths and a cyber cafe? BTW the cyber cafe was talked about on this site in 2013. Huh. Yeah, owners have a say, we matter. Selling, investing and renting a tiny place is looking really good now. No, not in SC. Sun City has always been simple living. My parents never wanted much or needed much. The Greatest Generation was just that. They lived within their means. They enjoyed what they had. The new boomer BOD lost sight of that. Me, I, you must, you have to. We need but you don't get to say.
Weren't they talking about turning Duffyland into lawn bowling at one time? Or was that tongue in cheek. I can never tell with people here.
Give me a break! We currently have 7 courts at 5 different locations, do you really think that data supports have all those courts? Perhaps they could add one of the courts back somewhere else but do we really need too? Remember, although it's nice that our courts are used for National Tournaments, they weren't built for outside use, they were built for us! Just my opinion!
And just for the record, did anybody notice that during the Planning Session they did in fact make a decision when they decided not to allow any comments at the next Exchange to be about the PAC, and they will hold a Special Session just about the PAC? I thought actual decisions can only be made in "meetings"? Hmmm?
I think there are two plays being performed this year, but I could be wrong. Several Sun City performing groups have indicated they will not be using the theater because it is too small to fit their audiences. My concern, shared by many, is we are bucking the trend by building a theater and an indoor pooch park. These two items together cost at least $15.5m. That is a lot of money with a very uncertain member benefit. Personally, I agree 100% with the city center concept if incorporated into a master redevelopment plan for the community. I have convinced myself that I am smart enough to know that I don't know what a great master plan would look like but know there are people who do that kind of thing. I hope we can be humble enough to get the help we need. It is very important that the community get this right. I believe the original plan for Mountainview was unaffordable. I hope this does not sound negative. I believe we all have made great strides toward a more open and honest form of governance. I told someone at the meeting today that I believe an organization is only as sick as its secrets. I hope we are on the road to recovery. Best regards and God Bless, John
Lordy we are spending 14M on a guess. I have no words anymore. I do know I am tired of being called stupid because I ask questions. Josie P. Linda You are sounding like Bill. Probably on purpose so no one will read. Use the KISS principal if you want people to pay attention Linda McIntyre •Palmbrook•27m Josie my response was lengthy; however, a $30M operation is not simple; neither is trying to fix the issues we have. The members can't have it both ways. Josie P. •Boswell Blvd•15m Linda, I appreciate your efforts to do what you think is best. We just need some basic information. Not all of us are experts in a 30M operation. To be honest, I'm feeling overwhelmed with everything going on here. I'm considering selling my home and renting instead. No more recreation fees, no more concerns about RCSC. Just cash out and move on. Linda McIntyre •Palmbrook•5m Josie sounds like maybe a good option for you. Life changes for people. We know many members don't know (or understand) the complexities. Just trying to bring some information I feel is important. (this will be fun for my article) Josie P. •Boswell Blvd•Now Linda Well thanks Linda, just because some of us don't understand the complexities of a 30 million dollar operation that we supposedly own/bought in to does not mean we are stupid or don't want to understand. Guess I should just move back to Toad Suck Arkansas. I do miss the catfish at the Toad suck Inn. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toad_Suck,_Arkansas All conversations are saved. There are people who feel the same as I do.
Janet, I saw recently that the Virginia Piper Charitable Trust does things like this. The Trust that is always mentioned on PBS. What the heck!
