Does the data and trends support the cost to build a Sun City theater?

You don’t build the size of a church based on Easter Sunday. That’s crazy. Building a theater period is foolish. How many people are joining the theater group and who is going to come watch the performances 10 years from now. Go stand in front of any current venue and see the age of the audience as they file in. They will be long gone by the time this project is completed. It’s time for forward thinking, not reliving yesterday. Where the hell is this new master plan?

 

Agree Larry, posted similar on SC Advocates. How much money can current residents afford? Found this article. No clue what is happening with this either. https://www.yourvalley.net/sun-city...c-believes-residents-should-pay-to-pay,479356

 

Lois Prichard is a Sun City West resident!
Sun City RCSC is NOT charging a processing fee to those members making payments with charge/credit cards. In fact, they are encouraging cards vs. cash…like with the guest passes going cashless.

The more you know:
Cash vs. Credit Card Payment Tale of two Sun Cities Recreation Centers RCSC and RCSCW

It’s become common to see small businesses promoting cash payments to compensate the processing fees they incur. Signs advise customers there’s an additional fee if paying by credit card, usefully about 3%.

Sun City, RCSC is moving to cashless. Payment online by credit/debit card for security and convenience at the web portal. First up are Guest Passes to be sold online beginning in April. Other areas requiring payment are in development for online, too. RCSC going cashless will increase credit card use AND credit card bank fees! Is that an expense we can afford? Or will we start being charged a fee like Sun City West is hoping to pass?

Sun City West will vote in June whether to start charging fees to members making credit card payments. Last year they spent $620,000 in bank fees associated with credit cards in the two main areas of golf and membership.

Will their members start paying more in cash creating new cash handling procedures? Larger on site safes, armored truck service for secure bank deposits?

Sun City West Independent story, Credit card fee discussions continue at next workshop in Sun City West (They were going to vote in February, moved it to June) Here:
https://www.yourvalley.net/sun-city...inue-at-next-workshop-in-sun-city-west,476506

Something to think about.
~ EO March 2024

 

Yes Chris, they are encouraging cards over cash and the members are not happy about it. I was speaking with George's Cafe and they want cash, not credit cards. I don't know Prichard, however it was an issue at one of the board meetings here in Sun City which I will find. Why would an article pertinent to SCW be on the front page of the SC Independent titled RCSC believes. You can be so tedious. Thank God I have the patience of Job.

 

I honestly had not. While I appreciate the work committee members do, I simply don't have time to sit thru videos of them 'at work'.
I did find the web page and read thru
"NEW! Click to Read the Utilization Study" which was great except for a couple of hiccups, like: It was written in first person, but not signed nor dated. And also curious to see Pickleball hit 116% at Marinette some month. What exactly did that look like? People playing two different games on same court?
Interesting answer to one of my question to John about comparative numbers was contained in there: Tennis utilization approx 20%, 9.7%, and 9% across three facilities.

So I didn't see the committees final recommendation to the Board with it's supporting documentation. Is it on that page somewhere?

 

Web page? I want to watch today’s board meeting before I respond to your question.

 

First of all this is Sun City. For those that still live here it doesn't matter what Sun City West does or does not do. Why you are posting SCW info is baffling. How do you know how much they pay in CC fees but not how much we pay? Are they that much more transparent with their residents? I remember one member spoke to the cashless move here as the dumbing down of America. The members do not want it. They would like to have a choice, however as usual the board does not work on behalf of the members.

That being said now that we are being forced to use credit cards, when the fee goes up drastically for the cc fees to RCSC any bets on how soon the charges will be passed on to the residents? Something to think about.

 

The utilization study was published by a member who does great research (Gary Osier) He had no agenda and no committee position so I give it great weight. Now on to the 116% utilization figure for pickleball. I will not give a sarcastic answer. The figure was calculated by Chris Hering using assumptions about the number of hours each player plays supplied by the Pickleball club (3 hours average play time). Hence, I believe the calculation is essentially correct but the assumption is wildly incorrect - the average pickleball player does not play for three hours every time they play pickleball. Even as a tennis player I agree we do not have enough players. I wish there were more but we have to realize that tennis is physically demanding. Outdoor tennis courts like outdoor pickleball courts are relatively cheap to maintain. Lets face it, air conditioned buildings are very expensive to build and maintain.

 

How much for mentioned building John?

 

Something Susan B. asked kept rattling around in my brain. She asked how much it would cost just to fix the irrigation, ponds and remove some landscape. I completely understand the course would not be of the same quality as the other courses but doesn't that mean we would have one course for purely social play that was not quite up to "par". I believe the plan is to completely redo/redesign the course and we may have overlooked an opportunity to have a hackers course in our mix and save some dough for other courses/projects. Just a thought.

 

One board member got a quote of $17M from the SAC architect.

 

That is a lot of money, for sure.

 

And they still don't know if the existing building has good bones?

Talk about putting the cart before the horse!

 

My fear is that they have already made their mind up!

I got kicked-out of two committee meetings along with the other guests, Budget and Finance and Long Term Planning because they went into an executive session to talk about the T-Bird property. Hmmm? What didn't they want us to know?

 

Jeezzz FYI, you are such a drama king. Now for some facts.

You were not kicked out of the B&F meeting, you were politely asked along with other member guests to leave because an executive session was about to begin. I note than none of the others who exited with you have played the WLB card.
The committee was unaware that there was going to be an executive session called. We were as surprised as you this was happening. We were only provided limited info regarding the real estate deal, which now has become part of the public domaine. No sneaky shit there. What happened at LRP, don’t know, wasn’t there, don’t care.

I doubt minds have been made up as real estate deals are very complicated, especially involving commercial property. This is not like buying a house from a flipper.

B&F has made no recommendation or even discussed the deal as we are more concerned about the current revenue stream in relation to the budget, seeing the 5 year plan and what it covers, starting to talk about next year’s budget, reviewing the reserve study at our next meeting and planning rollout, town halls on budget and 5 year plan. So you see B&F really doesn’t have the time to fuel your paranoid thoughts.

The best I can say is it looks like I work on a Committee for the third time in a row that works through through the summer. I have no idea what the plans are for LRP this summer.

 

Seems to me that's a distinction without a difference!

As far as the LRP committee meeting goes, the Chair handed out 81/2"x 11" floor plans of the T-Bird building then asked if there were any comments from the guests before they went into executive session. My comment was to remind the Chair that the committee could vote to allow the guests to stay during the executive session which would have held us to the same secrecy standards, and by asking us to leave only reinforces Members suspicions that something is being hidden.

Of course the Chair never even entertained the suggestion and totally ignored the opinions of the remaining committee members who may have had a different opinion?

 

I don’t know if a written final recommendation was given to the BOD. After the SAC was disbanded I believe LRP group developed at least two alternatives for the members to see at four “town halls.” This is my recollection and is why you may want to watch the videos. If not the SAC videos try one of the town hall recordings.

 

As far as I know there was not a final written recommendation given to the Board from the SAC. The vaguely worded elements that the Board passed were developed by the President (perhaps with some help). The "elements" were initially presented as essentially Plan M from the SAC Committee but members quickly saw through this and recognized the Board had essentially ignored the SAC. They were revised slightly to take out the tent city aspect of them and then passed. I publicly objected the board was not using proper procedure but this fell on deaf ears. Quite honestly, when I read the motion the Board Passed I am not sure what they are going to do other than hire an architect to work with the "stakeholders" to make all the design decisions and draft construction documents. I have no idea who the stakeholders are or what, if any, guidelines they are following.

 

No final report to the Board? Which means the SAC committee is still in effect?

RONR 50:10 "A special (select, or ad hoc) committee is a committee appointed, as the need arises, to carry out a specified task, at the completion of which—that is, on presentation of its final report to the assembly—it automatically ceases to exist. A special committee may not be appointed to perform a task that falls within the assigned function of an existing standing committee."

 

My, my, my! It seemed to me that the hard work done by the SAC was hijacked by special interest groups. What a shame!